Monday, February 23, 2009

Anticipation

The frum blogosphere is full of tirades from both men and women, frum and OTD, regarding taharas hamishpacha. Yes, this is another one. I think my perspective on the subject is somewhat unusual, but of course that may just be ego talking.

A few months ago, I would have told you that I don't mind keeping taharas hamishpacha; in fact, I was grateful for the mandatory respite from sex. Imagine - two whole weeks when he can't even ask me! Two whole weeks without worry! Gevaldik!

That's not how I feel anymore, though. I've started feeling that taharas hamishpacha is contributing to my dislike of intimacy. The halachos of taharas hamishpacha - and yes, that so-welcome mandatory respite - are contributing to my feeling objectified. I feel like we don't even have a chance to work on developing an emotional bond or a friendship that would make me happier to be bound to this person for the rest of my life: our relationship is halachicly focused on sex, on the woman's sexual cycle. The woman is a sex object, no matter how chivalrous the man is. No matter how much he pretends - or even tries - to focus on the woman's other qualities, the most important part of their relationship is going to be focused on whether or not he can touch her.

I am makpid on negiah. At work, where I spend my day mostly with goyim, I am very careful to avoid touching men. Although it's not particularly comfortable, especially in my line of work, I refuse to shake hands with people. I ask them not to touch me in platonic ways. Still, I'll admit that if it's something that the person clearly didn't even notice doing, and it's unlikely to ever happen again, I sometimes let things slide. I know that my husband is not going to be embarrassed or unhappy if I point out his own infractions while I'm a nidah, but I'll admit that there are times when I let those slide, too. If he passes me something without thinking about it, or if we forget to put a heker on the table, and I notice, sometimes I say something, and sometimes I don't. To be honest, sometimes I forget some of the harchakos. Not the negiah ones, but the heker and things like that. Sometimes I forget. Never that I'm a nidah, but sometimes that I'm not supposed to do something. I'm pretty good, but I'm not perfect. And it doesn't even bother me to slip up on these things; I'm having a lot of trouble appreciating the beauty in taharas hamishpacha.

Anyhow, my point is that since sex is not a part of anyone's relationship at the office, and since I don't believe I'm viewed as a sexual object in that setting, I don't focus on touch in building relationships - and neither do the people with whom I work. We build healthy, functional working relationships - and yes, friendships - without sexual undertones. No, I would never have considered marrying any of them, and no, sex never enters my mind as the natural progression of a close relationship, but still - I don't even think the men in my office think of that as a primary part of our relationships. Even the ones who like me and think I'm pretty. Even the ones who consider me a friend. (All right, I got pretty good at sending out "keep away" messages during college. I don't think any of them think of me as a good possibility for a relationship. Or even thought of me that way prior to my marriage.) Thus, I feel justified in believing that not all men think about women in a sexual context at all times. In fact, I'd be willing to say that most men are capable of thinking about other things than sex.

So I'm forced to assume that this seeming obsession by young frum married men with sex is caused, at least in part, by taharas hamishpacha. Imagine being forbidden any sort of sexual outlet for the 20-odd years leading up to marriage, and then only being able to think about sex 50% of the time. We're talking about young human men who have spent a lot of time working to develop their minds. They are hit with a whole new set of halacha when they get married, and they think about it non-stop. Horny newlywed kollel guys? Blame taharas hamishpacha. Maybe a more casual attitude to things like "affectionate touching" - within the bounds of marriage; I'm not advocating throwing out negiah - would cause fewer horniness issues.

All that horniness, I think, is one of the things that is hindering my ability to build a relationship with my husband. I don't see him as sexually attractive at all, and there are some things that I could finger as distinct turn-offs. If I'm trying to build a sex-based relationship here, there's really pretty much no hope. And I can't build a platonic relationship, because my every day is a constant reminder of my nidah or non-nidah status, and we are forced to constantly think about our sexual relationship. Either I'm counting the days I'm menstruating, or I'm counting the days I stick a cloth up where really I'd prefer to have nothing at all going, or I'm anticipating requests for some sort of sex and either trying to force myself into willingness or trying to come up with valid new excuses why I'm not willing. There is never a vacation. I'm always on duty, and I'm always feeling like an object.

I can't say I look forward to mikvah night. I don't find the mikvah a humiliating experience, but I don't enjoy it. I don't see it as a spiritually uplifting experience. I don't sense a profound direct connection to G-d when I'm standing in the pure waters of the mikvah. I try to daven for a better connection with my husband, hoping against hope that my kallah teacher is right and there is a special power to tefillos from the mikvah. I do it, because I feel like it's the right thing, and there's always this tiny hope that it will work.

The last time I went to mikvah, I took along a book to read in the tub. I managed to get myself in a much better mood than I ever had prior to sex. It lasted until I got home, and then the good feeling evaporated. But still, that one time, I looked forward to mikvah night. Why? Not because I eagerly awaited a reunion with a special person, but because I was finally in a mood where I'd be able to handle my duties, and if I could do them that night, I'd be off the hook for a while. Somehow, I don't think that's the anticipation that halacha had in mind.

28 comments:

  1. "Frum Blogosphere". It's like Military Intelligence, you're sure it's an oxymoron but you know things would only be worse if it was.
    I was going to post a comment a day or two ago about the sex issue and what I'd gleaned on the other posts to date. But this post (in part) confirms my supposition.
    The issue is clearly isn't the sex. The sex is merely a physical symptom of the problem. The problem is that there seems to be now intimate/close connection between you and your husband. Which isn't surprising in the shidduch system, but it is something that needs a lot of work after marriage. People assume the love will grow unassisted, this is not the case.
    Maybe you could try focusing on some of your husband's really special qualities that attracted you in the first place, this will help build affection. At the same time, you could give him some detailed tips on how to make the sex significantly better. (Remember halachically he's supposed to please YOU, not the other way around). After all, with no pre-marital experience he's unlikely to be particularly good. It's like any team sport, it requires a lot of practice.
    Finally, as to horny avreichim. I have it on excellent authority that men of all stripes are equally obsessed with sex. Especially newlyweds. If the taharas hamishpocha does exacerbate the situation it definitely doesn't make things significantly worse.

    ReplyDelete
  2. By the way there seems to be a problem with the comments section. It's impossible to post using internet explorer 7, and it only works via the preview section on Safari.

    Mike (C_A)

    ReplyDelete
  3. I concur that the laws of nidah, particularly the added rabbinical stringencies, are detrimental to the development of a romance. Immediately after consummation, the couple cannot touch each other for seven days! That’s the week of the sheva brochos we are talking about! The first days of honeymoon! And this is not even a Talmudic law! And all those harchoko non-touch nonsense is torture—brutal torture. The couple cannot relate to each other even as strangers do. This makes life simply unbearable.
    Not to mention if there is a sheilah with the shmateh cloth. This is exactly what you want to show your husband the night you go to mikvah; a stained-soiled cloth. It really whets the appetite.
    I don’t know if the rabbis who compiled all these laws just wanted to destroy out sex lives, or they honestly thought if we wouldn’t place an odd object on the dinner table we would end up in bed.

    ReplyDelete
  4. Bilingual,
    I am a 30 yr old financial consultant by day, Lakewood wife by night (although granted, not a kollel wife anymore.).I too, live life in two languages. I read your blog today, and my heart is broken for you.

    I have so much to say to you. I don't know if any of it will help. I see that you have mentioned therapy several times - I hesitate to offer you any suggestions or advice, since no doubt you have heard it all before.

    I'd like to offer you support. How can I help?

    I know the blogosphere is supposed to be anonymous, no faces, no accountability, but I am available to talk, via email or in person, and maybe to be a friend. let me know if you are interested- if not, I certainly respect your right to privacy.. (can't say I won't comment on your blog, but hey, if you make your bed in cyberspace, better be willing to lay in it!)

    With great respect for the journey you are on, and sincere wishes that it takes you towards happiness,
    B
    PS- I see prior posts warning you away from meeting people in person-- I guess that is good advice from a safety perspective. If you were interested, we could meet someplace very public and you could bring a friend or 2 or 3 or 5. or a stun gun (just kidding).

    ReplyDelete
  5. i feel for you, and almost kind of undesrtand from a reverse angle, as a guy. my wife and i got very lax with the harchokes, i stopped trying to be so makpid about negiah at work, and now my wife wont go to the mikvah. i dont know if it is all related; however self control has limits, and i hope i never stray, although the mind wanders on occasion...

    ReplyDelete
  6. Some points... coming from a perspective of a frum "wife"... though much, much farther along in the journey of marriage/life... I have come across COUNTLESS accounts of men, both jewish and non-jewish, acknowledging that "Men are visually stimulated" while women are "Emotionally stimulated" and one cannot really understand how the others mind works vis-a-vis sex/horniness etc.

    Of course, there are always exceptions to rules.

    But I thought if you can make peace with that fact - then perhaps it may help you jump over that "hurdle" - that place where you seem to be stuck at re: taharas hamishpacha and it's perceived ramifications...

    Also, I want to tell you, that although I was, BH, blessed with a more comfortable start to all this... (and I worked hard for it, and continue too!) I've had close friends that were not so lucky - BUT - have worked real hard and most have very satisfying relationships at this point. The key - I've gathered - was to never be afraid to "ASK!". ASK for what might make you more "turned on". ASK for what turns you off to change (think creatively of ideas - WHAT you can ASK for that might help change that feeling.)

    Men do not "get hints" like us women might.

    Also, us women sometimes think it has to be "natural" for it to be "genuine", which might also slow down the process of a great sexual relationship. It might be worth a try - to "fake it" for a time or two... and watch how one bounces off the other's enthusiasm... and it grows into a "real" and beautiful relationship.

    Great and satisfying sex is definitely something that "cements" a marriage relationship. So it's worth focusing on trying to figure out how to make it work!

    I also wanted to acknowledge that although sometimes taharas hamishpacha helps in the sex department, many times it seems like it hinders it too. Especially when the relationship is still so young - and hasn't had the "chance" to consistently develop. But time, effort and focus can really change that! So don't give up!

    (Keep the teffillos up - they certainly help - on many levels. Of course, you're looking for Hashem's help in this - but also - it will keep those small embers burning, so that you have from what to spark deeper feelings for your husband/relationship.)

    ReplyDelete
  7. I just quickly read through your other blog posts... and since you invited readers to comments and opinions - want to add another one of mine:

    I think you are not "committed" enough. EMOTIONALLY committed. From reading your other posts, I get the impression your still "looking around" and comparing "if and when" - EVEN IF - you are coming to the conclusion that you (at least theoretically) married "right".

    I think if you really "let go", and apply ALL your energy (sexual, emotional and otherwise) to your marriage/husband - you'd progress alot faster though this sometimes short/sometimes longer maze of "falling in love".

    Sometimes, when a person gets most of their "fulfillment" on the outside, and have a low sexual appetite - what is left for the husband to "give"? Hence, an opportunity for a gap in the marriage relationship.

    Just wanted to add to my previous comment - which was based on solely your last post.

    ReplyDelete
  8. it took me a while to grow into sex.
    the only way i started to enjoy sex was when i didn't have to. when i could engage in negiah up to any point that I wanted to. In the end i was screaming for it.

    but i learned the hard way that you can not force your pussy. If you hurt it, it will hurt you. it won't pretend, even if the entire rest of your life is a pretense.

    especially if the rest of your life is a pretense. your pussy can't give in. it has a job to do- to keep you honest. maybe one day when you resolve things you'll thank it.

    in the meantime i suggest you obey it. if it says no, than no.

    K"S

    ReplyDelete
  9. first of all, for those who do not know, when a woman loses virginity, her vagina is a WOUND that needs to HEAL thats why doctors RECOMMEND to avoid sex a week or two afterwards, so shomer negiah is not that bad you know..
    a woman in judaism is NOT a sexual object thats why it is FORBIDDEN to have sex with her when her cervix is vulnerable i.e. during periods and afterwards.
    I have been reading your blog ever since you started, and you have already blamed the system,your husband, Lakewood, and taharat ha mishpacha for your marital disaster. Maybe you should start with yourself, first. The one who is really objectified in your posts is your husband who does not do the trick that was mentioned in the instruction on his package. It really seems that you think that if you are from the right family and earn a lot of money, you authomatically get a husband who can satisfy your every need from the day one. I guess you should change your attitude to the whole thing and realise that marriage requires some effort from both of you, and a lot of communication too.

    ReplyDelete
  10. dainty parts,
    there is absolutely no medical basis to your post whatsoever.
    (nor any halachic basis- there is no halachic source that gives those explanations that you just gave. kiruv propaganda does not qualify as a legitimate source.)
    but even if there was, its possible to do plenty of negiah that has absolutely nothing to do with the vagina.
    you seem to be reading a different blog than me- bilingual does nothing but blame herself and try to change herself.
    KS

    ReplyDelete
  11. pseudo-Medical and halachic issues aside. I'm inclined to think Dainty has a few reasonable points about Bi's attitude ...

    ReplyDelete
  12. huh? she's killing herself for this marriage and as far as we can see, demanding nothing.

    KS

    ReplyDelete
  13. to the guy whos wife won't go to the mikveh,
    why not?
    is it a problem in the relationship, or sex? or both?

    KS

    ReplyDelete
  14. To K"S:
    I actually got it from non-Jewish sources and heard from my own OB-GYn so I wouldn't call it strictly pseudo-medical.
    I don't say she is demanding anything. But she is expecting too much.
    This guy who got lax about negiah and taharat hamishpacha is exactly the illustration why a couple should do a lot of seemingly ridiculous things in order to protect the purity of your family

    ReplyDelete
  15. KS - "THIS marriage"? From reading through this bog, I think most will agree, and I believe "bilingual" herself said so somewhere... I don't think "this" marriage is the problem - but it may be more of an overall "attitude towards marriage" problem (stemming from? Who knows... MAYBE it has to do with upbringing, MAYBE with personality, MAYBE with depression(?) MAYBE with any one of a million things.) But one thing is for certain - happiness in and out of marriage is within her reach, (based on her own description of husband, potential etc.). Her challenge is to find the KEY to it!

    ReplyDelete
  16. I don't pretend to know the problem, it could be anyone of those things plus more, but to call her selfish and expecting too much out of marriage is exactly the opposite of this blog. She expects nothing and gets nothing, and puts her own needs last.
    Dainty... I am a health care professional myself. Perhaps you are simply more dainty than the rest of us?
    KS

    ReplyDelete
  17. though of course, whatever the original problem, bad sex can kill even a good relationship, and vice versa.

    ReplyDelete
  18. "She expects nothing and gets nothing, and puts her own needs last. "

    Are you actually reading the blog, or just projecting?

    ReplyDelete
  19. Fascinating discussion, y'all - I've been following by email until I could get back here. Some responses, in no particular order:

    Who said anything about intercourse?
    How am I supposed to know what might turn me on? How do I know that anything he can do will turn me on? I definitely know that there are a number of physical characteristics that turn me off, and there's not much he can do about some of them. The rest? Yeah, I've asked. No change so far.
    How am I supposed to know if it's bad sex or a bad relationship? I have nothing to compare the sex with. I'm not even sure what qualifies as sex (as opposed to foreplay or whatever).
    Committed. You say that like there's a switch I could just turn on. I know I'm not committed enough. I've tried to say to myself, "This is it; get over yourself." It doesn't work. How do I make myself more committed?

    Dainty - you get a post all your own. Coming as soon as I type it.

    ReplyDelete
  20. you don't need to compare the sex to anything to know it's bad. here's a hint- you dread it, don't enjoy it, and sometimes it hurts. (what exactly qualifies as sex is a national debate, as we see from the clinton scandal. but whether its good or bad is pretty clear!)

    is it bad relationship or bad sex? thats why i asked you, did you like your husband before the yichud room or not? chronology can sometimes give us a few clues.

    kis

    ReplyDelete
  21. KIS - Your question is a good one. I spent a lot of time before the wedding wondering if my discomfort with my engagement was caused by the big unknown of marriage or by the fact of the person to whom I was engaged. One of the pitfalls of the shidduch system is that it's not always so easy to tell, and my advisors all assured me that it was marriage, and not my fiance, that I was worried about.

    I can't say I liked my husband before our marriage, but I didn't have any negative feelings either. I was pretty pareve about him. I recognized him as a great guy who had all the qualities I wanted, and at the time, that seemed to be enough. As an "older single" (older than 21, that is), I was encouraged to do things the checklist way.

    My tipoff in the yichud room was when he tried to touch me and kiss me, and I realized I didn't want him touching me that way. It's funny, because a few weeks later I was at a Shabbos meal with an older single guy, who someone was trying to set up with a very nice girl who he didn't find pretty. He said, "If I'm going to marry her, I have to want to kiss her." Before I got married, I would have encouraged him to go for it anyway. By that point, though, I thought he was 100% right and wished I had known that too.

    ReplyDelete
  22. Oh - and to Becca - Thanks for the offer of support. I can't think of a way for me to really take advantage of it, although if you have anything to say that would be helpful, I can give you an email address to send it to. I'm a bit wary of meeting people in person, though. Thanks anyway for the offer.

    ReplyDelete
  23. KIS - wow, have you not been told thaT? when I was single shadhanim would always tell me to think if i really want to be intimate with the person i am dating.

    Bilingual - i'm flattered=)) looking forward to it

    ReplyDelete
  24. I realize that you're not looking to be "fixed" (absolutely no pun intended!) and this does not address the emotional stuff at all, but if there is pain during intercourse (and I've got loads of experience with that) there are things to try, because it could be a medical issue. Assuming it's not a lubrication issue (that can be fixed with KY, etc)
    After going to a frum sex therapist (yes, they do exist) with my hubby, I was encouraged to consult with my gyn to rule out the medical - I ended up going to a physical therapist who specializes in women's issues, specifically pelvic floor issues. The therapy itself (and the homework) was uncomfortable, but the results were worth it.

    I also purchased something called the "lover's cushion" which helped tremendously - it's available online, I got it for approx. $35.00 - also very worth it.

    I also had to deal with an extremely obnoxious urogynocologist who decided that I could not possibly have experienced pain when he did an internal exam (his quote? "If I would have nicked you with a scalpel then you would have a legit. claim") who decided I was too uptight and prescribed a mild dose of clonazapan (I think it's an anti-depressant) to be taken before intercourse. I never took it - he's the only one who made me feel like a sex object in my whole ordeal.

    And, nothing to do with the above, but sex is on EVERY guy's mind, whether they tell you that or not, whether they conduct their relationships that way or not. Are there any guys reading this who will be honest enough to confirm?

    ReplyDelete
  25. when you were single, did you sometimes find yourself attracted to other guys? Did you ever think (in a positive way) about kissing or otherwise touching them? Did you sneak cosmo magazines sex articles and get all turned on like I did?

    Or did you NEVER allow yourself to think in this direction?

    You were emotionally pretty parve about him, but you think it may have just been fear.... But sex aside, before you were married, did you enjoy spending time with him in a way that you do not now? Did you look forward to your visits and time together or were you just blah?

    The answer to these questions might give a clue whether the issue is you or your husband.

    K"S

    ReplyDelete
  26. You wrote: I think my perspective on the subject is somewhat unusual, but of course that may just be ego talking.


    Yes, you have a unique perspective. No, it's not just your ego talking. Trust your opinions a bit more.

    ReplyDelete
  27. "And, nothing to do with the above, but sex is on EVERY guy's mind, whether they tell you that or not, whether they conduct their relationships that way or not. Are there any guys reading this who will be honest enough to confirm?"

    Yes of course :)

    ReplyDelete